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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi all,

We're supposed to pick up Elliott on Tuesday, but I just got an email from the breeder telling me he developed "cherry eye" and that I'll need to get it surgically fixed by our vet, as this is not covered under her contract. She said it costs about $200.

Now...I don't even know what cherry eye is, so I'm researching that now and will call our vet on Monday.

Does anyone have experience with this? She said it's the first she's seen in her pups- it's common in Cockers- and his is very small.

I checked her contract and it indeed says that cherry eye is not covered.

I don't know what to do : (
 

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is it not covered by the insurance that he will be coming with, or the insurance your taking out on him?

i think a dane i know had it, their are vidios on youtupe of ways to fix it for a couple of days. honestly dont know much about it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The breeder doesn't replace the puppy with a healthy one or pay for the procedure. So I have to decide whether to take him or lose my deposit. But I know nothing about cherry eye, so I'm researching it now.


is it not covered by the insurance that he will be coming with, or the insurance your taking out on him?

i think a dane i know had it, their are vidios on youtupe of ways to fix it for a couple of days. honestly dont know much about it.
 

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this is one of the reasons we take insurance out on our pups from the day we get them. (as in it starts the day we pick them up)

the breeder realy should be sending the pups home with 4 weeks insurance that the cherry eye should be covered by.

how long have they given you to decide?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hi Kendal,

Insurance wasn't an option; in fact, I've never heard of it out here.
She simply said that we should take him in for surgery, which would cost about $200. She did not offer to pay for it or even lower the price of this pup.

My heart is broken! From what little I've seen online, there can be problems with fixing the eye- it can cause dry eye, meaning needing drops for the rest of its life.

I emailed the breeder back asking what we can do to make this work. I can't believe it's fair to expect me to pay an extra $200 (and who knows- maybe my vet charges more?) for a puppy we haven't even picked up yet.

It would be like picking out a new car and being told that it has a big scratch on it that would cost $$ to get it fixed. Who would purchase the car, if that was the case?

I've put a $250 deposit in this pup. Not sure what she will come back with, but I'm really upset. We were to pick him up on Tuesday. She said she noticed it but thought it would resolve on its own, but since it didn't, wanted me to know what's going on.

: (
 

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Hi Kendal,

Insurance wasn't an option; in fact, I've never heard of it out here.
She simply said that we should take him in for surgery, which would cost about $200. She did not offer to pay for it or even lower the price of this pup.

My heart is broken! From what little I've seen online, there can be problems with fixing the eye- it can cause dry eye, meaning needing drops for the rest of its life.

I emailed the breeder back asking what we can do to make this work. I can't believe it's fair to expect me to pay an extra $200 (and who knows- maybe my vet charges more?) for a puppy we haven't even picked up yet.

It would be like picking out a new car and being told that it has a big scratch on it that would cost $$ to get it fixed. Who would purchase the car, if that was the case?

I've put a $250 deposit in this pup. Not sure what she will come back with, but I'm really upset. We were to pick him up on Tuesday. She said she noticed it but thought it would resolve on its own, but since it didn't, wanted me to know what's going on.

: (

do you know if the pups were ever checked by a vet, i know 2 cockers with dry eye who live a very hapy life.

the insurance thing is standered practice here it only seems to be acidental litters or breeders who just dont care who dont give you 4 weeks insurance with the pup.

i know someone whos pup got ill when with the breeder, she got beter before going to her new home, but further tests said she had liver problems, the breeder offered to take her back and refund them but the fell in love with her.

im not sure if i like the sound of your breeder, even breeders selling older pups who they dont have homes for yet drop their price because of the age of the pup being older than 8-9 weeks. i wonder if insurance aojld cover it concidering you know about it before picking him up.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I asked her what options I have, given the cost of surgery would be $200 or more (hoping she'd cover the cost or lower the price of this pup). Instead, she said she'd either give me my deposit back or let me purchase one of her remainder pups (much more expensive, as it is a tcup).
She did not offer any info about the outcome of such surgeries, etc.
I do know that when the other 2 pups in Elliott's litter didn't sell, she lowered the price and sold them very quickly after that.

I'm stumped.
I've not seen breeders here in the US offer insurance.
 

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Awww, I am sorry, this must be so difficult for you :( I don't understand why the breeder won't lower the price for you, if you still want to take Elliott home . What will she do with him if you don't take him home? Poor puppy, poor you!

I have noticed some breeders here offer 6 weeks of insurance with their puppies. Ours didn't and we still don't have insurance. Can't decide about it! I do know from what I have read that they probably don't cover pre-existing conditions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Well, I called the breeder. She was very nice, but kinda hurt that I"d ask her to consider knocking the price down, since I'll have to pay for surgery. She said it's not profitable- her prices are low (they are), yet...she did knock the prices down on Elliott's brothers when they turned 8 weeks and they sold right away.

She said she'd knock down $25, then she said $50. I don't get it.

I THINK what I'm seeing here is that, according to her, a cherry eye is no big deal. She's recommending I get it "tucked and stitched"; not removed, which she feels is barbaric and is the cause for dry eye.

The plan is I'll call my vet for his opinion and get back to her with our decision. She will give me the deposit back if we don't take him.

Here's how it looks (closeup):

 

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My sister had a puppy that had a hernia once, which is basically just a poking out umbelical cord. She called the vet, found out it cost about $100 to fix, and charged that much less. It didn't seem fair to sell a litter of puppies at the same price and tell one owner out of 7, "oh, by the way, this one needs a $100 surgeury, good luck with that!" Especially since you haven't even picked up your puppy yet.

I have heard that cherry eyes can have a problem with re-occuring, and may cause future medical problems. Or it could be fixed and never happen again. I just might be a little worried about a breeder that just expects you to pay for it, and doesn't seem to care much about it. If you did decide to go with another puppy you could put that same $200 towards shipping a different puppy to you from another breeder, if there weren't any other nearby breeders.

Personally I would vote for finding a breeder that doesn't up the price for T-Cup puppies (a term often used by back-yard breeders, along with warlock, royal, giant ect) or has to immediantly drop the price on her older puppies because they're still there (better breeders normally have waiting lists). Plus expecting you to cover the cost of the surgery. Does she do any health testing (patella/hip or eye?), are the puppies parents AKC registered or traceable? Do you have references from past puppies? It might be worth it to try to find a better breeder, even if they charge more.

You can check out other breeders on the http://www.cockapooclub.com/ website, just look for star rated breeders on the bar on the left.
 

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My sister had a puppy that had a hernia once, which is basically just a poking out umbelical cord. She called the vet, found out it cost about $100 to fix, and charged that much less. It didn't seem fair to sell a litter of puppies at the same price and tell one owner out of 7, "oh, by the way, this one needs a $100 surgeury, good luck with that!" Especially since you haven't even picked up your puppy yet.

I have heard that cherry eyes can have a problem with re-occuring, and may cause future medical problems. Or it could be fixed and never happen again. I just might be a little worried about a breeder that just expects you to pay for it, and doesn't seem to care much about it. If you did decide to go with another puppy you could put that same $200 towards shipping a different puppy to you from another breeder, if there weren't any other nearby breeders.

Personally I would vote for finding a breeder that doesn't up the price for T-Cup puppies (a term often used by back-yard breeders, along with warlock, royal, giant ect) or has to immediantly drop the price on her older puppies because they're still there (better breeders normally have waiting lists). Plus expecting you to cover the cost of the surgery. Does she do any health testing (patella/hip or eye?), are the puppies parents AKC registered or traceable? Do you have references from past puppies? It might be worth it to try to find a better breeder, even if they charge more.

You can check out other breeders on the http://www.cockapooclub.com/ website, just look for star rated breeders on the bar on the left.
 

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Such a difficult situation for you as you kind of bond with a puppy before bringing it home and it's something you've been looking forward to for a while. Heart says get the little fella and get him sorted and looked after, head says you are paying good money so want the healthiest puppy possible and should avoid long term problems and expense.

I would ask the vet you'll be using for their opinion and show them the pictures. Is it something that has been getting worse since she noticed it?

I would also ask why it isn't covered in insurance. Is it because it is an expensive, long term problem? I'm not sure that you'll be able to get any cover for it as the condition is already present.

Most breeders would offer an alternative puppy or refund the deposit if the chosen puppy develops a health problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thanks for your input. It is SO HARD to know what to do. Her prices are already low, so she can't go less than $50 off.

I am in contact with the breeder of this pup's DAD, who is the founder of the American Cockapoo Club (ACC) and SHE has been guiding me a lot throughout this entire process, since the breeder herself has not had enough time to answer all of my questions thoroughly. This woman has told me that my breeder is excellent, with good healthy dogs and that the surgery is a simple process that could be done when he's fixed, to save me money. She said the cherry is quite small and shouldn't present any problems later and shouldn't be a reason NOT to take him. She still owns my pups grandfather and she said my pup has very healthy lines with great temperaments.

Still...you have a good point- finding a dog that does NOT need surgery. I will see what my vet says tomorrow.

Here's how the parents of my pup are described on the website:

Dad: Health clearances: OFA hips, knees and patellas normal, Cerf'd
Coat: Non-shed curl
Mom: Health clearances: OFA patellas normal
And: Our breeding dogs are also health checked by our vet, and we only use healthy dogs with sound genetics in our breeding program.

And:
~~ are checked by our licensed veteranarian before they are placed in a new home. (Paperwork is included)

~~ receive their first puppy shot from our veteranarian, and are wormed.

~~ receive a neopar and are wormed a couple of weeks before going to the vets office for extra protection.

~~ have 24/7 loving care.

~~ learn to potty train to paper/potty pad and then to outside.

~~ are socialized by many different age groups and by both males and females.

~~ come from proven lines of high quality champion lines. Our breeding dogs must also pass health and temperament testing.

~~ are pedigreed and come from AKC lines.

~~ are registered.

~~ are weaned naturally to high quality puppy food and healthy supplementation.

~~ are guaranteed by our contract that is posted on our website.

*** (It is amazing how many breeders skip some or all of these steps to save time and money!)

Arghh....this is a tough one. : (
 

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So it all looks sound enough. I think your answer lies with the vets response. Hopefully they will say it's easily treated and will reassure you. Maybe get a couple of vets opinions as they often have quite different ideas and responses.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Yes, I can't wait to see what the vet says and what the cost would be. But now, many are telling me that the breeder should have offered to do the surgery before it came to this (pix on her website of him show the cherry if you look very closely- I didn't think to do that, but someone else looked just now). Those pix are from 2 weeks ago.

She did say she had hoped it would disappear, but as it hasn't, said I'll need to have it surgically repaired.

I dunno- it just doesn't sound right to me. Like someone said to me- if I'd picked out a brand new car and came to pick it up only to find a huge scrape on it, would the dealership expect ME to get it fixed?
 

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Surely, it's a matter of consumer law - you put a deposit down for a product that she is not now able to offer you (the product she is now offering you is not as it was described). Therefore, you should get your money back. It should be treated in EXACTLY the same way as a car, you're right. However, I don't think you can force her to lower her price, only to pay back your deposit. Is there a consumer rights association you could contact to be sure of this (not sure how US law differs from UK law - and I'm not exactly an expert in UK law!).

I think you should find out your rights and then, if I'm right, ask for your money back - perhaps that will focus her mind a bit. You could then point out that she probably won't get any takers for a dog with Cherry Eye, so without you she'll be facing having to pay for the operation herself and then (from what you've said) selling the dog at a reduced price because it is older. I think she is counting on the fact that you have bonded with the puppy and that you won't want to say no.
 

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Doesn't sound right to me either - the pup is gorgeous and the problem may turn out to be minor, but why are you expected to pay for the op - the pup still belongs to the breeder until it is paid for. Hope the vet gives you good news, but you should still not have to pay for the op, whatever. Good luck, whatever you decide to do.
 

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Sounds like a good breeder by that. Can't say for sure her dogs temperaments, but health seems great.

That does make me reconsider the find another breeder thing somewhat.

But the cherry eye does still bug me. Might she have another litter soon?
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
The good news is that she did offer to give me my deposit back. And I'm hoping that she IS counting on me to go through with paying for the surgery, thinking I've already bonded with the little guy.

So my HOPE is that my vet will reassure me that it's a simple and inexpensive procedure (maybe do it while he's being 'fixed'").

THEN I tell her that I'll move forward but expect her to pay for all or part of the procedure. You guys are right- if I back out, it will be a much bigger problem for her. Maybe she's watching to see how I play this out, hoping I'll hang in and just take him. But it's not right.

Sound good?

Otherwise, does anyone know of a litter available now or very soon in the USA? I think she is expecting more pups, but it'll be a few months before they're ready and I'm looking for a spring pup.

BTW, you guys have been FANTASTIC. Thanks for all your feedback and support!
 

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Im gob smacked, I really cant believe she wont knock you that amount off, as Kelly says if you dont take him she still has to rehome him and try and sell him with the condition. Yeh see what the vet says , show him the picture, if its straight forward and over and done wiht then i would just be striaght and tell her you want the price reducing ( surely she wont want you backing out) but if its a long standing problem sad as it sounds I think id have to walk away ..............oooh sorry hope it all turns out the way you want it good luck x
 
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